Whitecaps off field incidents

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Soccer_dude, Jun 20, 2017.

  1. Soccer_dude

    Soccer_dude Member

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    Any thoughts / comments regarding the handling of the Whitecaps recent off field "troubles" involving the youth team & there starting RB?

    The youth team alleged incident seems pretty disturbing ...
     
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  2. easoccer

    easoccer Established Member

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    Sexual Assault and Domestic Abuse are serious issues. Im not up on the details but from what bit I read I hope it can all be resolved professionally and justice served.
     
  3. TKBC

    TKBC Established Member

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    Likely no one is up on the details.

    Re: sexual assault charges - Crown doesn't proceed with charges without evidence, but that doesn't mean something won't be negotiated, charges reduced, nor that the kids will be found guilty. However, even if they aren't found guilty of the charges that doesn't mean something very serious didn't happen and the players need serious consequences in that case.

    Re: Domestic violence - there's a publication ban according to court services, which makes perfect sense from the legal perspective. The "Last Result" noted on CSO is that the matter is concluded "end" so I am not sure if that means the pub ban was the conclusion or if the issue/charges have been resolved in some way. Something to keep in mind, again, especially in these cases a finding of not guilty doesn't mean something very serious didn't happen it means that some aspect of the legal options is not satisfied (or however you want to put it). The spouse can often recant, which is very sad, and would also result in charges dropped. But, in K files the Crown etc can proceed if they have enough additional evidence to prove assault - but I don't know what the conditions are that have to be met for that to happen.
     
  4. Total -Base

    Total -Base Member

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    The player did get attacked by his teammates. That tells you what is going on over all. One can see it when you see what is going on at U 12 youth soccer and type of selections they use. High level soccer is nothing more than pay to play here and even more selection of kids of board people and coaches kids. One has to look very hard to find five kids that made it from Caps or HPL level anywhere. Ask you self why, and even more stay away fro it all to save your children from abuse and your self from money wasted. Stay and play club soccer forget Caps and HPL let them get players from other countries. Save our kids from total crap.
     
  5. JDFMike

    JDFMike Member

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    my thoughts is that they handled it extremely poor. you don't try to hide this type of thing or handle it 'internally'. what they should have done is got the police involved immediately, then they should have been pro-active w/ the entire community, especially academy members, and detailed what happened and the steps they will be taking to ensure this never happens ever again. they should be easing concerns further w/ protocols that all their academy and residency coaching must adhere to (background & crim record checks - i'm sure this is already in place but put it out there anyhow). sexual assault is not something to be trifled with especially when young lives are involved. what about the victim? or the perpetrators? that one incredibly stupid incident will haunt them all for the rest of their lives. it also makes me question the culture w/in the whitecaps residency program...again, why did they not pro-actively address this? very poor judgement by management and something i personally won't be forgetting anytime soon.
     
  6. TKBC

    TKBC Established Member

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    The police were involved from the beginning. Who said otherwise? Why are you talking about the coaches as if they were the offender? None of them were involved in the incident in any way, shape, or form.

    Define proactive? Do you believe the Whitecaps don't outline behaviour expectations for all players entering residency? I can assure you they do. Can the Whitecaps learn from this and adapt? Probably, but you nor I know enough to make that call. It's quite likely they did everything correct, and this happened anyway.
     
  7. JDFMike

    JDFMike Member

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    wha? did you read my post?

    i am not talking about 'the coaches as if they were the offender', where did i say or imply that in any way? i said 'they should be easing concerns further w/ protocols...' meaning they had an opportunity to get out in front of this. define proactive? really? my comment was more about the missed opportunity to get in front of a horrible incident and ease the minds of the community that's involded, and all the parents that have kids in their academies.

    the police being involved from the beginning does not jive w/ the news reports:

    “Where they dropped the ball immensely was… not reporting it,” the mother told Global News in June. “I think that the police needed to be called immediately.” The mother believes the Whitecaps were the first to find out her teenage son was allegedly sexually assaulted but they didn’t act fast enough. “Our gut instinct was that they were trying to downplay it and protect themselves,” she said. “We felt that they wanted to deal with it internally and not let it get out.” Former Whitecaps youth residency players in court next week on sexual assault charge
     
  8. TKBC

    TKBC Established Member

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    You brought up that the Caps coaches need to have criminal records checks done. That suggests you believe they are responsible for this incident. You can also be 100% certain the coaches all have criminal records checks done. Guaranteed.

    Ok. Thanks for engaging in conversation but I'll end it here. It's pretty clear you don't know about the residency intake process, RCMP investigations, nor how to deal with victims and offenders in this scenario. (tip before you reply to this: dealing with situations like this is my career.)

    If you are a parent of a child in the residency program please enlighten us all. If you are you can clarify if a behaviour expectation conversation occurs before any players joins the residency program.
     
  9. JDFMike

    JDFMike Member

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    you need to either go back and read what i said or check your reading comprehension because i never actually made any implication that caps coaches were 'responsible for this incident'. in no way shape or form have i implied that any WC coach was responsible whatsoever. this is the 2nd time i'm saying this to you now.

    anyhow, what's with the passive aggressive 'tude? i've given you the context i meant and for some reason you're choosing to ignore it, then you say 'i'll end it here' then go on to throw in a 'tip'...??? i didn't come here to get into an internet argument. it's 'my thoughts' from the perspective that they didn't handle it well given what is known (i gave you a direct quote and link from somebody with more knowledge than both of us) and that the club extends beyond the residency as they have a lot of children involved and it is my feeling they could have been more forthcoming to assuage not only other players and families in the residency but also parents w/ kids in their academies. if you disagree fine, but don't put words in my mouth.

    ps-i am not enlightened nor claim to be, but i have 2 boys in the academy so if it's OK with you i'll have my opinion.
     
  10. JDFMike

    JDFMike Member

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    came across this article ( Whatever happened to the teenage dream? – Whitecaps need to ask some searching questions around their youth development – AFTN ) last comment has some relevance and is very troubling if accurate:

    "From a parent who’s child was chosen by and played for one year in the whitecaps youth residency program, what we saw take place should be questioned. The fear-based coaching and constant negativity resulted in my son making the choice to leave the program in June after being asked back for the next season.

    He went from receiving little playing time and being put down by his coach to top goal scorer in the program by the end of that year due to an outside coaches positive influence on him and our support; not fear.

    But even as top goal scorer, negative comments continued and statements came from his Whitecap coaches like “Don’t think you’re that good.” “You’ve got a long way to go to be good.” And my favourite “The gap is still huge for you” was the feedback.

    So many questions… Why can’t these coaches see intrinsic motivation? They don’t need to threaten these kids. If they did need it they shouldn’t be in the program. Why do the coaches feel the need to put these kids down? They’re already nervous enough knowing they could be cut at any point. Why are the coaches unaware these kids are emulating their bullying behaviour with their own teammates?

    Then an assault took place in the dressing room against a boy that had already endured a year of bullying by those same teammates at the end of the season; it was by their top 2 players. How could this happen? Whether the coaches did know or didn’t know about the bullying of this boy, they should be held accountable for it being allowed to happen. It was their job to know, to look after each child in the program. It happened because the coaches didn’t involve themselves with the players as people and these boys felt they were top dogs, allowed to treat others like they had witnessed.

    Why was no one speaking up I wondered? No one wanted to make waves. Parents said to me, “Where else can these kids go? There aren’t other options”. I couldn’t accept this answer as a parent of a hardworking boy with a dream, too kind and respectful for this type of behaviour and negative environment.

    In the end no change was made and no coaches were fired. More questions came up as I compared this program to a workplace. I’d never treat people that worked in my organization like this, even when I had the power to do so, so why are they? Who’s in charge of this program and it’s success? Who judges what success looks like? I’d suggest homegrown players is not a KPI.

    It is an internal problem within the Whitecaps organization. It needs rebuilding with people that have experience and understand that positivity, encouragement, hard work and success are not mutually exclusive."
     
  11. TKBC

    TKBC Established Member

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    I have heard a story or two about the coaches poor communication methods there - and favouring certain players regardless of that players attitude.

    I watched a game last year and I remarked how "I'd cut a certain player after he acted like that on the pitch at this level." (the player was exceptionally critical of his teammates and it was clear the other players were fearful because no one remarked on him when he made some pretty poor mistakes). The response to my remark? "The coaches tell everyone he's the best player." My concern then became "why are the coaches telling the team who their best player is? That's insanity to do that at any age, but especially teenagers!" ....

    I also received a remark once that "I'd not hire that guy for my academy" which was basically responding to the question "why are the Caps not developing pro-level players?"

    I've met Dalrymple once, and I watched him involved in a session. He seemed very appropriate, though that's obviously a small sample size. He didn't know I was watching the session (nor would he have any reason whatsoever to care!). But I also heard about an instance when Dalrymple and a Caps coach were screaming at each other basically from across the pitch during a u18 match a year or so ago because in Dalrymple's opinion the team was not performing adequately (for sure there'd be much much more to that story). That's anecdotal, not evidence, of issues.

    But are the Caps to blame for these young players actions? No, definitely not. These teens are responsible for their own decisions.
     

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